Embracing Interdependence: Nurturing Bonds in Parenthood

In this solo episode, Dr. Cristina delves into the concept of independence, examining it from the perspectives of both parents and children. The inspiration for this discussion came from a listener's question about co-sleeping with her four-year-old twins. This query prompted a broader exploration of infant and childhood sleep patterns and the societal norms surrounding independent sleeping.

The episode delves into the historical and cultural practices surrounding sleep. From communal sleeping to  private bedrooms, Dr. Cristina discusses how this transition was driven by concerns of modesty and privacy, reflecting evolving societal norms.

She also discusses co-sleeping, a practice that varies widely across cultures. Dr. Cristina emphasizes the importance of understanding these practices within their cultural and historical contexts. She acknowledges that co-sleeping remains a topic of contention, with differing perspectives on its benefits and risks.

Dr. Cristina challenges the idea that independence should be the ultimate goal for both parents and children. Drawing from compassion-focused therapy, she asserts that humans are inherently wired for nurturance and connection. She emphasizes that interdependence is a defining feature of humanity, essential for survival and overall well-being.

Thanks for listening! If you are a soon-to-be or current parent of multiples, be sure to head over to my website http://www.fiercekindmama.com to get my FREE resources designed specifically for you!

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Transcript

Dr Cristina Cavezza:

In today’s episode, I want to talk about the notion of independence – what does it mean to be independent, how do we learn independence and is it necessary or even achievable to be completely independent

I want to talk about this from the perspective of parents, or mothers more specifically, as well as from the perspective of the child

And what got me into thinking about this topic was a question I received from a listener 

She wrote to me and said I’m a single mother with three kids, I have 4 year old twins and another school-aged child and my 4 year old twins still sleep in my room 

She then said that when the educators at child care found out that her 4 year olds still shared a room with her, that they thought that was a bit unusual and in her words she felt judged by them

She was wondering if it was and I’ll put this in air quotes – she wondered if it was normal for her four year olds to be sleeping in her room 

So, this got me thinking about a few things – about infant and childhood sleep and the push in many Western cultures for independent sleepers – like where does that come from? Is it rooted in science as being better for children and adults? Is it a social construct? In other words, does it vary across cultures and historical contexts? And if so, then what does it mean to be independent? It is necessary? Is it achievable? 

Now, I may be the wrong person to ask about independence in the context of childhood sleep 

And I say this because at the time that I am recording, I have 7 year old twins who still sleep in their parents’ room and often one of us ends up sleeping in one bed with one and the other parent sleeps with the other child in the other bed all in the same room 

Now you might be thinking – you must have a really big bedroom and yes, we do 

The bedroom for good or bad is in fact large enough to fit two our bed as well as two single floor beds for the kids 

So, I realise that many listeners will have more than 2 children and will most likely not be able to fit all of their kids in one giant room 

But I also realise that there will be many listeners who think that is really unconventional and undesired 

Like shouldn’t and I put that word in air quotes – shouldn’t a 7 year old be able to fall asleep independently and stay in their own room 

I also know that for many parents it is really undesirable to have their kids in the same room 

I acknowledge that even the thought of having school-aged kids still coming into your bed everynight might be off putting for some

And I won’t lie – I have grappled with this same issue for a few years now – we in our family have tried all sorts of sleeping arrangements over the years and right now the easiest routine that we have found is to be close to one another 

The question that I am interested in as a scientist-practitioner is am I ruining my children because I allow them to remain close to me at night 

Am I setting them up to be dependent adults who won’t be self-sufficient or resilient 

Am I as the case of the listener who wrote to me – am I doing something wrong?

So, I decided to turn to the research 

And more specifically, to historical and cultural practices 

Because I think the reality is any behaviour that we deem as a society to be wrong or right or good or bad needs to be seen in a specific cultural and historical context 

What I find really interesting is that how we sleep in terms of with whom and where has evolved over time and across cultures 

In the 5th to 15th centuries in most of medieval Europe, sleeping was largely communal 

It was super common to have many people sleeping in the same bed even people from different families would often share beds and bedrooms 

It was seen as a way to share space, to increase personal security and to simply keep warm

Later than in the 15th to 17th centuries particularly in the British Isles, household beds began to be seen as important and reserved for those that could afford them

While entire households of European peasants still occasionally shared beds – In Western, contemporary, industrialised cultures we were moving towards this idea that sleep ought to be an individual and private experience

And the thinking around this was that being alone was actually more conducive to getting optimal rest and recovery 

During the Victorian era in particular around the early 1800’s to 1900’s – they began questioning the practice of having many sleeping bodies sharing a single bed 

There were concerns about incest and promiscuity and so social norms and dictates began to shift where each person ought to have their own bed that was in a private not public space, and that he or she ought to wear appropriate clothes for the purpose of sleeping

So here we see the rise in private bedrooms 

And what happened in most Western industrialised cultures was that the availability of an individual sleeping space became a sign of wealth and prosperity 

And of course our medical and scientific understanding of sleep developed as well and there was greater understanding of the risks of parent-child co-sleeping in terms of SIDS and sudden infant death syndrome 

Research has shown that parents that choose to co-sleep with their children are sometimes seen as being negligent or selfish and that can lead to feelings of embarrassment, shame or stigma

Now, I am not going to advocate for one approach or another when it comes to co-sleeping with your children 

I will leave it up to the sleep experts to give you individual advice about what is best for your family when it comes to whether or not you should co-sleep with your children 

And there are many guidelines around safe sleeping practices for infants and children 

What I will say is that parental bedtime behaviours can be grouped into five types or categories

The first is active physical comforting like cuddling or rocking

The second is encouraging autonomy – so this might look like offering children a special toy or blanket as a sleep aid

The third might be settling with some form of movement – like walking your children in a pram or stroller to encourage sleep

The fourth is passive forms of physical comfort, like lying next to your children’s bed

And the last might be what we’d call social comforting which could involve reading a bedtime story

The use of such bedtime practices typically varies depending on our children’s needs and age

We might cuddle or rock our children when they are infants but we are probably using other practices like lying near or children or reading them a bedtime story when they are bit older 

I think it’s really important to note here that there is a strong influence of society, culture and ethnicity in terms of values, expectations and practices 

What we define as normal versus problematic in terms of sleeping arrangements depends on where we’ve come from, what we’ve been exposed to and the messages we receive from those around us

Co-sleeping is one of the most common bedtime parental behaviours in the majority of cultures around the world but it is still considered relatively controversial in Western cultures 

So going back to the listener’s question around am I doing something wrong if I allow my four-year-olds to share my bedroom 

Then I think we need to understand the social and historical context in which that question is being asked 

Most parents I meet today would say your four-year-olds are old enough to sleep independently 

You just need to be firm and set appropriate boundaries and it might take time but they’ll get there 

They are perfectly able to fall asleep on their own and stay in their own bed all night 

Decisions around co-sleeping as I’ve already mentioned varies greatly though among cultures

In some cultures even today, no child or adult sleeps alone

It’s not uncommon to have grandparents sleeping with other adults and even visitors to all sleep together 

In fact, the vast majority of adults in Western post-industrial societies do not sleep alone 

Despite different sleep patterns or requirements – like some adults may snore or have restless legs – or may want a warm blanket whereas the partner doesn’t and so on 

Despite some couples being very different in their sleep patterns and needs, they continue to co-sleep 

Why?

Because co-sleeping in couples tends to be associated with intimacy, companionship, trust, vulnerability, and a feeling of being together

Hi there fierce kind mama

Are you expecting multiples and wondering how you are going to cope when the babies arrive?

Or do you already have multiples at home and wonder will this ever get easier?

First of all, let me say loud and clear: I get it!

Feeling overwhelmed in motherhood is really common and us mothers of multiples are particularly prone to feeling sometimes like it’s all too much.

I know for myself that becoming a first-time mother to twins at the age of 40 was a huge adjustment physically and psychologically. 

So, I’ve taken my years of training in mental health and my experience coaching mothers of multiples and put together a guide with my 5 top tips for overcoming overwhelm as a multiple birth parent. 

This guide is free of course. And it doesn’t matter what age multiples you have. You may be pregnant, or your multiples might have already left home. The principles apply to all parents of multiples. 

And because I know you are short on time, I’ve broken down the tips into easy-to-read chunks that you can begin implementing straight away. 

You can get your free copy now by signing up at my website: www.fiercekindmama.com 

When it comes to parents co-sleeping with their children we see lots of contention here, right?

At one extreme, we see leading health organizations saying there are real health risks like SIDS

While other experts will say that there are ways to mitigate those risks like using appropriate bedding and having parents and children in the same room not necessarily in the same bed 

These experts would say that from an infant mental health perspective as well as from ease of feeding, it can be really beneficial to have that closeness with your children at night

Wherever you and your family lies on this continuum, or whatever your own personal beliefs are about this contested issue, it is the norm in many cultures to sleep with children from birth, particularly in indigenous, unindustralised societies 

We also see intergenerational co-sleeping in some cultures, particularly in collectivist Asian countries

It is true that the presence of another individual in your bed or bedroom may have a negative affect on your sleep quantity and quality – in other words, you might not get as much sleep or as sound a sleep if you share your bed or bedroom with someone else – and this applies to both having another adult or a child or children in your room and bedroom 

So, in my view it really is an individual family’s choice 

What I am more interested in is in the notion that we need or we ought to or we should be encouraging independent sleeping in our children 

Like where does that idea come from?

That if my child can’t sleep on his or her own that means he or she won’t develop independence?

We’ve already acknowledged that most adults don’t sleep on their own – they are often sharing their bed with another adult or even a pet 

So, what does that mean about our capacity as adults to be independent?

I think that in the context in which I live – that is, in an industrialised, Western society -  we place a lot of importance on independence 

On being self-reliant and productive 

And I think back to my some of learnings, particularly in a specific treatment modality called compassion focused therapy – which I won’t go into all the theory behind that 

But what I will say is that from that perspective, humans are all born with an innate desire or tendency to want to be nurtured and to nurture others 

As soon as you are born, your primary goal really is to be cared for, to be loved, to be looked after 

And as you develop and individuate from your caregivers and gain more autonomy, most people develop a desire to nurture something else 

This might take the form of caring for your own children

But it might also be wanting to care for elderly parents or maybe you choose to help others through your profession or volunteering

Maybe you just want to take care of the environment 

Basically, what I am saying here is that we are meant to be in close proximity with others 

From an evolutionary perspective, we are designed and built to live in social groups, not in isolation

So, dependence, and interconnection is a defining feature of being human 

We learn how to survive only through being in contact with other humans

We are able to find food, shelter and protection only through co-operating with others 

In other words, the irony of independence is that we only learn to be autonomous individuals from the social groups we live in and rely on 

Even as adults we are inherently dependent on one another

We are living longer 

As we age, we become more and more reliant on others to help us and in some cases even attend to our needs on a regular basis 

In our workplaces, our actions have a ripple effect 

We do not work or live in isolation 

We need each other to function well 

This applies to the practice of mothering or childrearing too

We sometimes equate our self-worth by how much we can achieve on our own 

Like being independent and doing the bulk of the childrearing and domestic labour is seen as being a supermum and is held up as the pinnacle of good mothering

But I question this 

I question the need for mothers, and for children, to be independent 

I think it depends on what we mean by that

I think we do ourselves and our children a real disservice when we push really hard for independence and we think we are failing or we feel bad when we need to ask for help or when we need to rely on others

There is no shame in asking for help 

And I would take it one step further and say there is no shame in being dependent on another person either 

In fact, our very existence is contingent on how well we support one another – how interdependent we are 

Going back to the listener’s question about sharing a room with her 4 year old twins - In my view, a child who needs help to fall asleep or desires comfort, closeness and warmth is not bad – 

The parent is not doing anything wrong by providing their children comfort and closeness at night as long as those sleeping practices are safe according to established guidelines 

And this last point is super important - the child and his or her parents do not need to feel shame or embarrassment for needing or wanting help at nighttime or really at any time 

And at the same time, there may be very good reasons for why a family chooses for children and adults to sleep separately 

It might be that sleeping in a private room means everyone gets a better sleep 

And there are certainly many examples of adults who prefer to sleep alone even if that isn’t the norm

What I want to reassure the listener who wrote to me and asked me that question and to anyone else who is in a similar position 

In fact, perhaps this entire episode has also been about reassuring myself and my children that striving for independence may not be necessary

As an adult and as a mother, I don’t need to do everything on my own 

In fact, trying to do so may actually be to my detriment and to the detriment of my children 

And equally so, my children don’t need to do everything on their own 

We can be dependent on one another and we can still be successful and live productive, healthy lives whatever that looks like for you 

So, I hope that was useful to you and gave you something to mull over and reflect on in terms of both your childrearing practices and your expectations of yourself and your children 

One of the most important lessons I have learned as a mother is to not rush my children’s development 

Even in those times when I wish they would do more for themselves, I really try to strive for a balance between encouraging some level of autonomy that is appropriate for where they are at developmentally 

And I also like to remind myself that it’s okay for me to be dependent too 

That even as an adult, being 100% self-reliant is an unattainable target 

And if I can accept my children’s dependence then I can accept my own too 

And my wish for you is that you too find solace knowing that you are not alone and you do not need to do everything on your own and you don’t need to force your children to do everything on their own either 

Thank you for joining me today and I hope you’ve found something from today’s episode that resonated with your own experience or that made you reflect on your own behaviour and expectations of yourself and your kids 

If you have any questions you’d like to me to address on this podcast, please don’t hesitate to contact me at hello@fiercekindmama.com 

Take care and we’ll see you back here soon

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Any advice and information in this podcast is general only, and has been prepared without taking into account your particular circumstances and needs. For tailored, individualised advice, please consult with a qualified professional.